Two-Handers get the shaft.

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Two-Handers get the shaft.

Post  Kombat Karl on Fri Apr 08, 2011 8:42 am

I'm hoping that this doesn't come off as whining but rather hoping to add some more diversity to the game. I've found that if you use a two-handed weapon you have lost the ability to really take advantage of most of the awesome changes to the Fighter class.

When I first made my character I didn't realize that without a shield, I couldn't use the charge ability, or the auto knockdown ability, which to me are pretty much the only reasons to take high amounts of fighter, other than the awesome gear they get.

I also have found that.. the damage you do with a two-handed weapon here, really is easily comparable to a single handed weapon due to the high magic content of the server. (aside from the scythe criticals)

So basically what I'm asking for is something for the two-handed weapon users that they could use, like the charge or auto kd ability, but instead of the same things something a little different that compliments the two handed weapon user rather than the same things that a shield/sword user would get. I think it would add a bit of balance to the the mod between the different melee classes.
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Re: Two-Handers get the shaft.

Post  CJ_RULZ on Fri Apr 08, 2011 8:51 am

i've seen Than (a two-handed weapon user) hit for over 300 damage... never seen that from a single handed weapon user

arent the charages and stuf like the only point in going fighter and using a shield?

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Re: Two-Handers get the shaft.

Post  Kombat Karl on Fri Apr 08, 2011 8:56 am

I said "aside from scythe criticals", that means I agree that is not comparable to single handed weapons. I'm talking more about non-criticals, any wm can pick up a scythe and do large amounts of damage with critical hits. I'm speaking about anything -other- than the WM with a scythe.
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Re: Two-Handers get the shaft.

Post  Rugnarie on Fri Apr 08, 2011 9:03 am

Paladin/BG with a scythe. =)

But seriously. I saw Gunnak hitting for 230dmg....With an axe and shield! That's just crazy. If you add 2 charges to the equation, I see no reason why to make 2 handed fighter/rogue/wm. 1handed definitely > 2handed.
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Re: Two-Handers get the shaft.

Post  Kombat Karl on Fri Apr 08, 2011 9:04 am

that was the point I was trying to make.. I just didn't want to point out builds/chars to make my point.
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Re: Two-Handers get the shaft.

Post  CJ_RULZ on Fri Apr 08, 2011 9:09 am

if you going to make a twohanded put a decent ammount of monk levels in theire and use hit and run tactics, yes with wm an axe has a x4 crit thats why its damage is high but its threat range isnt that good, you could always use a great axe for higher damage as dwarven war axe does 1d10 + str x4 greataxe does 1d12 + 1.5xstr x4 so the damage and im pretty sure you loose your charges if you take monk levels.

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Re: Two-Handers get the shaft.

Post  I Almost on Fri Apr 08, 2011 9:51 am

The damage for one handed and two handed weapons isnt much of a difference, perhaps 50 at max with a greataxe.
The only reason two handed weapons are slightly better is because of the damage properties on the weapon.
The only two weapons who reach crits above 300 regular are the Merc greatsword and scythe.
Most of the people only grab large weapons when they get monk lvls because of the little axtra damage and with a shield you lose your monk speed.
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Re: Two-Handers get the shaft.

Post  Kombat Karl on Fri Apr 08, 2011 9:59 am

I just think that for losing a total of 8-9 ac from shield, then not being able to use charge, or auto kd. Two-handers are way underpowered when you average it out. I'd like to see something that benefits two-handers in the same manner as it does shield users ie, non-monks. Monks already get imp kd for free at 6 and imp evaision at 9, and monk speed and at 20 +1/20 DR and mind immune and all that other stuff, so someone could easily make a high level monk two hander that is efficient, but if you don't want to play that, if you want to play a pure fighter, or a pure barbarian, you lose out if you don't use a shield/sword combo, and I think thats wrong.
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Re: Two-Handers get the shaft.

Post  J. Persinne on Fri Apr 08, 2011 1:23 pm

I Almost wrote:The damage for one handed and two handed weapons isnt much of a difference, perhaps 50 at max with a greataxe.
Assuming a maxed (or almost maxed) STR score, you're looking at a difference of about 10 points of damage when comparing a greataxe to a battleaxe. Assuming about 40 damage per hit with the one-handed weapon, we're looking at a 25% increase of damage with two-handed weapons. How is that in any way "not much"?

That said, I agree that non-monk two-handers need a bit of love. At one point I had a notion that we could tie some extra abilities into uses of the weapon master's ki damage ability, but with regards to specifics, I've got nothing.

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Re: Two-Handers get the shaft.

Post  Felix on Fri Apr 08, 2011 3:06 pm

Isnt there a charge that none monk two handers can get that gives them +4 ab on the first strike but no KD?
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Re: Two-Handers get the shaft.

Post  Kombat Karl on Fri Apr 08, 2011 3:08 pm

Not that I know of, I searched the Moth Forums and -all- of the Fighter charges required a Shield/Sword. Auto KD included.
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Re: Two-Handers get the shaft.

Post  I Almost on Fri Apr 08, 2011 8:48 pm

I meant on a crit with 1 handed vs 2 handed excluding scythe/Merc greatsword Kumo ^^

There is indeed a melee rush that can be taken but as Karl said, shield i s required.
But the there is a problem with just giving 2 handers with Ki strike a extra something. If monk lvls are involved this could be abused or become over powered. I would say a pure ''melee'' 2 hander should get bonuses, but if monk lvls, or rouge lvls etc are taken these bonuses should be lost or high requirerments.
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Re: Two-Handers get the shaft.

Post  J. Persinne on Fri Apr 08, 2011 9:37 pm

Yeah; monk/WMs with ki abilities would be a no go. They're quite decent already.

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Re: Two-Handers get the shaft.

Post  Felix on Fri Apr 08, 2011 11:57 pm

What if we changed the Melee rush to not require a shield?
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Re: Two-Handers get the shaft.

Post  Kombat Karl on Sat Apr 09, 2011 12:04 am

I'd be down with that, if its a simple fix.
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Re: Two-Handers get the shaft.

Post  Professor Plum on Sat Apr 09, 2011 3:30 am

One handed weapons suck as well.

Love for clubs, sickles, light hammers, light flails, katanas, maces, b.swords, morningstars and shortswords?

Oh and all the 2h double weapons.

And tridents, flails, quarterstaffs and halberds? They'd be scaled with ki-strike to be averagely the same?

Sucks that most of the weapons are just not as good as others. Sad
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Re: Two-Handers get the shaft.

Post  Felix on Tue Apr 12, 2011 6:07 pm

Kombat Karl wrote:Not that I know of, I searched the Moth Forums and -all- of the Fighter charges required a Shield/Sword. Auto KD included.

This is already in the mod and doesn't require a shield. I tested it today.

Charge: Thrust

Prereqs:
Epic Prowess
Epic Reflexs
No Monk Speed
21 single or combined levels of Barbarian, Dwarven Defender, Fighter, Weapons Master, Ranger, Purple Dragon Knight or Harper Scout.
No smiting abilites.



Description:
Once a day the meleer can thrust towards her target with amazing speeds.
The user teleports instantly to a target within 20 meters and starts attacking it. Grants +4 Attack Bonus on the initial hit.
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Re: Two-Handers get the shaft.

Post  Kombat Karl on Wed Apr 13, 2011 3:29 am

Sweet! i thought it was the same as the others but I suppose not Very Happy
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Re: Two-Handers get the shaft.

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